Track rubber...

Discussion in 'Motorsports' started by Eisenflower, Dec 30, 2003.

  1. Eisenflower

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    I'll direct this question to whom may know.. maybe John, Paul, Gord..
    I picked up a set of 15" rims for the track, and would be interested in picking up a set of descent track rubber. I by no means need a brand new set, but a good used set may do the trick for the amount that I would use them. Do you guys have any recommendations as to what type of tire I should look for? RA1's seem to be a popular choice, however i'm sure there may be a few more descent options as well? Some feedback would be greatly appreciated.
     
  2. AcidGord

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    RA1's are popular because they're easier to get. I personally don't really like them. I found a brand new (Albeit well worn) set of RA1's a lot less responsive than a 5 year old set of BFG R1's. (Discontinued now, great tire) I'd be interested to see what a new set feels like though.

    Kumho V700's are a good and economical choice. Yokohama A032R's are known to be great tires in the wet but not so much in the dry.

    But you'll have a somewhat difficult time finding a decent set of used race rubber anywhere around here. Not too many people using them and fewer willing to part with them. Though some of the IT racers will usually part with nearly-dead rubber for a good price from time to time.

    You might save youself a whole bunch of cash by picking up a set of Falken Azenis. I've never personally driven on them but they're widely known as being pretty much a near-R compound and they're dirt cheap.
     
  3. Eisenflower

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    Thanks for the info Gord, mucho appreciated! To be honest, I didn't really expect to be able to find much selection in good used track rubber locally for the exact reason that you stated. From time to time I see rubber advertised on csi in the For Sale Canada forum for pretty descent prices, however I was unsure of what a descent brand/model would be so I didn't really know what to keep my eyes open for. I'll keep looking in the meantime. I am certainly in no rush since race season is quite a ways away, so I thought I'd try and have some track-tire edjumacation flung my way in the mean time. :D
     
  4. Eisenflower

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    I've been wondering about the Kumho V700's, considering alot of the guys in the motorsports forum on csi seem to like them. They do look like a pretty nice tire. Considering I hated the Kumho 712's that I had for the street 2 years ago, I'm hoping these would be a better quality tire.

    [​IMG]


    And would this would be the same Azenis that you are speaking about?

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    Yokohama A032R??

    [​IMG]


    And these are obviously the RA-1's..?

    [​IMG]
     
  5. AcidGord

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    Eh, the 712 is what it is. A discount moderate performance tire. I haven't had any complaints with mine other than the godawful noise they make. (My snow tires are 10x quieter)

    Kumho V700's are pretty much designed for Autocross. There's also the V70A Victoracer from Kumho as well. If you read the archive threads on honda-tech.com is the Autocross/Road Racing form and it seems like there's a 50/50 split as to which tire people prefer. Boils down to differing tastes. Either one would be a hell of an improvement over ANY street tire though.

    Keep in mind that looks really have nothing to do with anything in R's too. Tread patterns don't mean much. You ride R's until the cords show. Often they'll drive BETTER when the tread is gone because you don't get any squirm. Thats why the hardcore folks will have them shaved when new.

    (Edit) Yup. Those are the Azenis in question, and those are the A032R's and RA1. All available at TireTrends.com for good comparrison pricing. :)
     
  6. pmachan

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    I have tried the Ra-1, 1st gen BFG R1, 2nd gen BFG R1 and the Khumo Victoracer. The Ra-1 and the Khumo are close, the 2nd gen R1 was pretty good, but didn't wear very well with out some serious negative camber.
    Good luck getting some used stuff, I would say to get what you can, as it will most likely be better than 99% of all street tires.
     
  7. AcidGord

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    Well the R1's had built in camber so with extra negative I'd imagine they'd wear like a bitch.
     
  8. PirateSteve

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    One thing for sure, , if you were looking for used rubber it would be much better to look for a 14". Almost every IT car around is riding on either 205/55's or 225/55's. I know I've given sets to guys for like 20 bucks a tire and they have lasted for a season of auto-x. I'll have to do some tire evaluation to see what I have. I know I've got about 15 or 16 tires that are nearing the end of their usefullness to me.

    Also I've always been a fan of toyo for their performance/price point. I've tried the old r1s, ,the g force, the yokos, and a set of hoosiers. The g force and the hoosiers were far and a way the best tires. But the Toyo to me, maybe because I have used it the most was the most predictable of the group. Very easy to find the tires limits and great wear.
     
  9. Redshift

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    I'm trying to decide what to run next year as well.. but since I need AT LEAST a 17" wheel to clear my brakes, my choices are somewhat limited.

    I have been looking at the Yokohama... currently TireRacks 2nd rated R-compound tire... (after the Michelin Sport Cup as I recall)...
    They should better then any street tires in the dry, and we've had enough wet/rain events (inlcuding the one where I looped my car into the timing gear) that their superiour wet traction is a big plus...
     
  10. pmachan

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    Yes, but they liked even more, I couldn't get any out of the car I had at the time, so they didn't wear well at all, I destroyed them in a season and didn't do many events at all.
    They acted more like a radial Slick racing tire like the BFG Trans-Am tires we are trying to use on the Vette, requiring a very different setup.
    I agree with Steve on the RA-1, great tire, most everyone uses them around here.
     
  11. AcidGord

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    Yeah, the RA1s are definitely a well priced tire. Like I said, I'd really like to try a set with meat on them. I'm sure the characteristics were changed quite a bit in the set I was using. You can see here http://pics.spoon.org/Cars/Slalom-at-Slemon-2003/Day0/IMG_2339.jpg that they were pretty used up.

    If I do buy new tires next year I'll definitely be getting 14's. 13's give me better gearing but if I'm going to get stuck in SP I want to leave myself open to put in some better brakes which I just can't do with 13" rims.

    Dave: The offer is still there to co-drive the heap if you're looking for a cheaper season. :)
     
  12. Eisenflower

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    Thanks for the info guys!
    If I can't find something descent in an appropriate size by spring, I may just say fuck it and buy a new set.
     
  13. pmachan

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    Hey Gord, I wouldn't spend much on brakes, I run Metal master pads, and thats it. They work mint, I can even get 3-4 laps full out at the track before they start to go. All I am doing for next year is another new rear caliper and a Teg master.
    I may have 3 Khumo victoracers for sale, 2 are mint.
    I am switching to slicks and going to mod I think, cheaper for me, as I can get the slicks for zero and already have 13's and a set of qualifier slicks.
     
  14. Eisenflower

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    What size are your Victoracers Paul?
     
  15. DC5-S

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    I'm debating between the kumho's and the yoko's...pretty much the same price...man i'm conflicted!! :confused:
     
  16. AcidGord

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    I wasn't going to go with a big brake kit or anything. Integra setups can be had for like $300 though and if I'm going to be stuck in SP why not. Its not really in the 'I'm going to do that' stage yet, but considering whatever rubber I might buy is sure to last me 2-3 seasons at least I want to at least keep the future in mind. Plus I'm going with 14's because if I do end up changing cars I want to be sure I can use the rubber/rims there too.

    I'm going to see if I can swing some kind of deal with Wheel and Tire Zone when spring gets closer. They already sponsor me through Wired, I might be able to swing Kumhos at a decent price in exchange for running some magnetics on event days if folks are interested.
     
  17. pmachan

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    Steve, My Khumo's are 205/55/14's. One is toast, one other is getting there, the other 2 are mint.
    I may sell the wheels too if I am happy with running slicks, they are 14" Teg wheels, painted bronze, I have a pic I can post later when I get home, Gord took it at Leon's last year.
     
  18. AcidGord

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    I was talking to some folks today about a possible group buy on race tires and I should have some more information in a week or two. Prices would be complete with shipping to Halifax and I should be able to arrange Kumho, Falken and Yokohama. (WTZ also carries Goodyear, Bridgestone, Firestone and Michelin but I don't know that they offer decent competition tires). As usual the more buyers the cheaper the tires.

    Question for interested people, would you be willing to run a WTZ magnetic on event days in exchange for a better deal on R's? I don't really know how much better deal yet but possibly a few %.

    I'll keep people posted if there's interest.
     
  19. DC5-S

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    Michelin has a nice r-compound tire....from what I've read on tirerack anyway...

    What does WTZ stand for? I'm having a small brain fart here...
     
  20. AcidGord

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    Wheel and Tire Zone, a shop in Mississauga with ties to Wired and who supports a lot of Ontario racing.
     
  21. DC5-S

    If you go, go balls deep

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    I guess I don't mind whoring my car...depending on how much better the deal is!
     
  22. stu mccrea

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    I have run the toyo ra-1's for years, and the yoko a032r's as well. The toyos have the best predictable handling, the yokos when hot are really squirelly, and release without letting you know, where as the toyos have a similar to street tire linear release at the limit.

    The kumo's are good as well. The michlean sport cups are retarded expensive, but really would like to see how they run, i know a certain fella who ran them at amp on his twin turbo porsche (who had years of racing experience) say they were the stickiest things he ever rode on, bear in mind he was probably use to bias ply race tires of old.
     
  23. DC5-S

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    thanks for the input stu. i was seriously considering the yok's...but after reading your expierience with them.... :confused:
     
  24. stu mccrea

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    i would consider the yoko's as a wet weather setup.
     
  25. Shafft

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    I'll take a set of those 14's from you if you have a set steve!
     

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